I love a good comeback story, so I always root for the Royals signing a bunch of cast-offs--like, a BUNCH--and then hoping they can bring them back up to quality play. Part of that, I suppose, is that there haven't been a lot of good storylines to follow with a slew of bad teams in a row, but mostly it's just my addiction to rooting for underdogs. It mostly didn't work out last year, and some of those cast-offs ended up standing in the way of young guys getting playing time, which was dumb and shouldn't have happened. So I guess I should qualify my "bunches" opinion with a rule that these guys should never be kept around for long unless they represent a marked improvement over what they potentially have available and can be part of a three to five year roster plan.
This is all a very long-winded way of saying that I hope they sign a bunch of these guys if they can get them cheaply enough and they aren't clogging the 40-man.
I'm not really sure it's fair to say that castoffs stood in the way of anyone. I mean Franmil Reyes was in the minors and then released quickly. JBJ was on the roster because Waters and Isbel weren't healthy at the same time and they wanted another center fielder and then he was gone by midseason. Duffy did play too much, but he didn't even play very much down the stretch and we saw that they didn't really even much space for Samad Taylor on a day-to-day basis. But I do think it's worth a shot. And I do like that they seem to be willing to move on from guys fast.
How we evaluate possibilities…….I like that segment. Can go all day on it really. See, I’d like to get away from the can they get us to 80 wins mentality as an organization to be honest. And we have seen this all the time. For example, they bet on having the talent as you mentioned. They were proven wrong, but with no consequence. Now, I’m hopeful with the new scouting director some more changes or coming, but doesn’t sound like this year. But besides, Witt Jr, Salvy, Vinny, and Ragans, nobody has really proven themselves on this roster and we can even look at Vinny (injury), and Ragans (injury, length) with a little skepticism. So if Cantrill, or Yarbrough (proven that he’s better than anyone we have), or Meadows, or Senzel, or Lewis are better than what you have now. You have to pick them up in my view. It’s fine that you didn’t last year. Year of evaluation…essentially starting over that’s fine. But they are to the point as an organization and a front office that you have improve everywhere you can and get to 75 wins first…then take the next step.
Not every signing matters, but I guess my point in looking at Quantrill in particular is that he's not very good. Or at least he wasn't very good last year and the peripherals indicated he shouldn't have been better than he was. Guys like that are fine as buy-low candidates, but I'd much rather they sign players who can make an actual difference than just settle for a warm body. I'd rather give Mason Barnett 20-25 starts than sign a 29-year old Quantrill just because he's better than the blank spot in a rotation right this second.
In general. Yeah, probably agree. But at the same time, the roster is bad enough that you can probably add Quantrill and still get Barnett 20-25 starts. Lol. And really, I hope it’s because Barnett earns 20 starts. We aren’t just giving him 20 starts to see what he can do. I just want to get to that point that Barnett coming up and starting IS the best option and he’s earned it.
Sure, but can you add Quantrill and someone who actually matters? That's my point. Like I said, I'm fine with it if they do it, but I hate the idea that you sign someone only because they're marginally better than a bad team's roster was last year.
"But I don’t think the criteria for a good signing is that they’re simply better than what is on the current roster because the current roster kind of stinks. That’s just something that rolls around in my head from time to time and I hope I articulated it well here."
Totally agree, and, yes, you did a good job of articulating the point. Thanks for touching on the Quantrill availability; I was curious what you thought of him.
On a much wider view, he's an example of why things have been so quiet. This entire offseason is going to be defined by the RSN fiasco and how teams affected by the Bally's/Diamond bankruptcy respond to the loss of revenue. Cleveland didn't just get rid of a guy who may or may not be worth a roster spot; they got rid of his ($6.6 million) salary at a time of major financial uncertainty.
Aggressive teams will see this as an opportunity to shop at the fire sale; others will be conservative and either not participate in free agency or (like Cleveland) dump players no one expected them to DFA.
I do agree that there's a lot of uncertainty around finances, though I'm not sure that was what led the Guardians to DFA Quantrill in particular. I would think that financial uncertainty would be a positive for the Royals given how little they've spent and how little they have on the books. Plus, the general public doesn't care about that when they're supposed to vote on a stadium. I think the Royals can take full advantage.
I agree, I think even if Sherman would otherwise tend to be conservative in this situation (and we don't know if that is the case), he's kind of backed in a corner by the stadium vote - it will look bad if there are good players to be had and they don't go after them due to budgetary issues. I'm cautiously optimistic that the RSN situation will work out in our favor as fans, both in terms of signing a deal with ESPN or some other provider that's better than Diamond (can't be worse, right?) and in terms of team construction.
I'm glad you said that we don't really know much about him as an owner yet, because we really don't. At least not what he's willing to put into payroll. But yeah, I think they'll need to spend some this winter. I don't know if the financial deal will be better, but I would guess it'll at least be in range of what they were getting anyway but with the added value of fans actually being able to see the team more than they can now.
You mentioning not really knowing much about him as an owner made me think of something I have thought of in the past but have never really seen elsewhere, but what kind of effect do you think him never having a "normal" season as an owner has had?
What I mean by that is that 2020 was the covid year, 2021 was the limited attendance year, 2022 was the lockout year, and 2023/24 have had the Bally issues. So every year of his tenure has had some kind of major outside issue so far.
I'm sure it's probably nothing, but I always wonder if that has had any kind of impact the last few seasons that more experienced owners may have been able to navigate better.
That's a good point. I've thought about it with some of the players but not really with Sherman and the ownership group. I guess you could argue that there are always some issues, but you're right.
You think the royals are one of the teams interested in Jonathan India? The .350 career OBP has to be intriguing. I can’t remember exactly but I know India was mentioned as a trade candidate mid season, and weren’t the reds interested in Singer at the deadline? Would 1 for 1 a good deal or should one of the sides be looking for more?
Sorry for asking something totally unrelated to the article but saw they were shopping India so I wanted to ask.
I wouldn't be surprised if they've had that conversation, but I'd also caution against overpaying for India as well. He was great in 2021 and deserved that ROY. He's hit .246/.333/.394 since with rough defense at second base. He could definitely move back to third, but he hasn't been especially good.
Good breakdown as anyways, really appreciate the good content, it seems you have cemented yourself as The Royals offseason content! Lol. I agree with Tracey, the TV deals concern me..
The TV deal with the ballpark and an attempt to sign Bobby concerns me even more. I just don't see Sherman and JJ spending much even in the second tier of FA. The farm and MLB team are nowhere close. But, they obviously know that and I love that they are spending on a Scouting Director, Analysts, Development director, hitting coach etc!!
Glad to hear they were in on Canha. I think trades is where they can make impactful additions and I agree, I really hope we see something soon!
The TV deal does concern me a little bit, but they also were still one of the lower-tier teams in terms of what they were getting, so they'll be impacted less. I still believe they spend a lot more than you'd think this winter.
I love a good comeback story, so I always root for the Royals signing a bunch of cast-offs--like, a BUNCH--and then hoping they can bring them back up to quality play. Part of that, I suppose, is that there haven't been a lot of good storylines to follow with a slew of bad teams in a row, but mostly it's just my addiction to rooting for underdogs. It mostly didn't work out last year, and some of those cast-offs ended up standing in the way of young guys getting playing time, which was dumb and shouldn't have happened. So I guess I should qualify my "bunches" opinion with a rule that these guys should never be kept around for long unless they represent a marked improvement over what they potentially have available and can be part of a three to five year roster plan.
This is all a very long-winded way of saying that I hope they sign a bunch of these guys if they can get them cheaply enough and they aren't clogging the 40-man.
I'm not really sure it's fair to say that castoffs stood in the way of anyone. I mean Franmil Reyes was in the minors and then released quickly. JBJ was on the roster because Waters and Isbel weren't healthy at the same time and they wanted another center fielder and then he was gone by midseason. Duffy did play too much, but he didn't even play very much down the stretch and we saw that they didn't really even much space for Samad Taylor on a day-to-day basis. But I do think it's worth a shot. And I do like that they seem to be willing to move on from guys fast.
How we evaluate possibilities…….I like that segment. Can go all day on it really. See, I’d like to get away from the can they get us to 80 wins mentality as an organization to be honest. And we have seen this all the time. For example, they bet on having the talent as you mentioned. They were proven wrong, but with no consequence. Now, I’m hopeful with the new scouting director some more changes or coming, but doesn’t sound like this year. But besides, Witt Jr, Salvy, Vinny, and Ragans, nobody has really proven themselves on this roster and we can even look at Vinny (injury), and Ragans (injury, length) with a little skepticism. So if Cantrill, or Yarbrough (proven that he’s better than anyone we have), or Meadows, or Senzel, or Lewis are better than what you have now. You have to pick them up in my view. It’s fine that you didn’t last year. Year of evaluation…essentially starting over that’s fine. But they are to the point as an organization and a front office that you have improve everywhere you can and get to 75 wins first…then take the next step.
Not every signing matters, but I guess my point in looking at Quantrill in particular is that he's not very good. Or at least he wasn't very good last year and the peripherals indicated he shouldn't have been better than he was. Guys like that are fine as buy-low candidates, but I'd much rather they sign players who can make an actual difference than just settle for a warm body. I'd rather give Mason Barnett 20-25 starts than sign a 29-year old Quantrill just because he's better than the blank spot in a rotation right this second.
In general. Yeah, probably agree. But at the same time, the roster is bad enough that you can probably add Quantrill and still get Barnett 20-25 starts. Lol. And really, I hope it’s because Barnett earns 20 starts. We aren’t just giving him 20 starts to see what he can do. I just want to get to that point that Barnett coming up and starting IS the best option and he’s earned it.
Sure, but can you add Quantrill and someone who actually matters? That's my point. Like I said, I'm fine with it if they do it, but I hate the idea that you sign someone only because they're marginally better than a bad team's roster was last year.
"But I don’t think the criteria for a good signing is that they’re simply better than what is on the current roster because the current roster kind of stinks. That’s just something that rolls around in my head from time to time and I hope I articulated it well here."
Totally agree, and, yes, you did a good job of articulating the point. Thanks for touching on the Quantrill availability; I was curious what you thought of him.
On a much wider view, he's an example of why things have been so quiet. This entire offseason is going to be defined by the RSN fiasco and how teams affected by the Bally's/Diamond bankruptcy respond to the loss of revenue. Cleveland didn't just get rid of a guy who may or may not be worth a roster spot; they got rid of his ($6.6 million) salary at a time of major financial uncertainty.
Aggressive teams will see this as an opportunity to shop at the fire sale; others will be conservative and either not participate in free agency or (like Cleveland) dump players no one expected them to DFA.
I do agree that there's a lot of uncertainty around finances, though I'm not sure that was what led the Guardians to DFA Quantrill in particular. I would think that financial uncertainty would be a positive for the Royals given how little they've spent and how little they have on the books. Plus, the general public doesn't care about that when they're supposed to vote on a stadium. I think the Royals can take full advantage.
I agree, I think even if Sherman would otherwise tend to be conservative in this situation (and we don't know if that is the case), he's kind of backed in a corner by the stadium vote - it will look bad if there are good players to be had and they don't go after them due to budgetary issues. I'm cautiously optimistic that the RSN situation will work out in our favor as fans, both in terms of signing a deal with ESPN or some other provider that's better than Diamond (can't be worse, right?) and in terms of team construction.
I'm glad you said that we don't really know much about him as an owner yet, because we really don't. At least not what he's willing to put into payroll. But yeah, I think they'll need to spend some this winter. I don't know if the financial deal will be better, but I would guess it'll at least be in range of what they were getting anyway but with the added value of fans actually being able to see the team more than they can now.
You mentioning not really knowing much about him as an owner made me think of something I have thought of in the past but have never really seen elsewhere, but what kind of effect do you think him never having a "normal" season as an owner has had?
What I mean by that is that 2020 was the covid year, 2021 was the limited attendance year, 2022 was the lockout year, and 2023/24 have had the Bally issues. So every year of his tenure has had some kind of major outside issue so far.
I'm sure it's probably nothing, but I always wonder if that has had any kind of impact the last few seasons that more experienced owners may have been able to navigate better.
That's a good point. I've thought about it with some of the players but not really with Sherman and the ownership group. I guess you could argue that there are always some issues, but you're right.
You think the royals are one of the teams interested in Jonathan India? The .350 career OBP has to be intriguing. I can’t remember exactly but I know India was mentioned as a trade candidate mid season, and weren’t the reds interested in Singer at the deadline? Would 1 for 1 a good deal or should one of the sides be looking for more?
Sorry for asking something totally unrelated to the article but saw they were shopping India so I wanted to ask.
I wouldn't be surprised if they've had that conversation, but I'd also caution against overpaying for India as well. He was great in 2021 and deserved that ROY. He's hit .246/.333/.394 since with rough defense at second base. He could definitely move back to third, but he hasn't been especially good.
Good breakdown as anyways, really appreciate the good content, it seems you have cemented yourself as The Royals offseason content! Lol. I agree with Tracey, the TV deals concern me..
The TV deal with the ballpark and an attempt to sign Bobby concerns me even more. I just don't see Sherman and JJ spending much even in the second tier of FA. The farm and MLB team are nowhere close. But, they obviously know that and I love that they are spending on a Scouting Director, Analysts, Development director, hitting coach etc!!
Glad to hear they were in on Canha. I think trades is where they can make impactful additions and I agree, I really hope we see something soon!
The TV deal does concern me a little bit, but they also were still one of the lower-tier teams in terms of what they were getting, so they'll be impacted less. I still believe they spend a lot more than you'd think this winter.
I hope so! Cant wait to read your opinion on the trades today! May end up being nothing in the end, but I absolutely love both of them!